Curse

*lemming* · Nov 09, 2010, 05:58 AM // 05:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lanier

its only laughable to those who care about pvp. I play pve, so i don't know which skills need nerfs in pvp nor do i care.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

I dont play GVG sorry, but Some of the guilds that ranked very well in that didnt use VoR or Empathy, and they still seem to have managed better than other teams that were using it. VoR seems to be balanced to me from looking at those results.

This goes for the rest of this thread: don't post if you don't know what's going on.

Eragon Zarroc · Nov 09, 2010, 06:15 AM // 06:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

General sin buff/nerf including an AP nerf and Temple Strike buff (I won't post specifics)

Shadow Form nerf definitely.....owait

maybe they will just rebuff it and give up

doubt we will get any skill updates >_<

bursta91 · Nov 09, 2010, 07:51 AM // 07:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhavv

I dont play GVG sorry, but Some of the guilds that ranked very well in that didnt use VoR or Empathy, and they still seem to have managed better than other teams that were using it. VoR seems to be balanced to me from looking at those results.

yes, hexes should stay untouched...

as lemming linked, almost every single elims was hexes vs something hexy.

Missing HB · Nov 09, 2010, 08:31 AM // 08:31

Rofl , so yes as i said all updates are centered around GvG.
People use hexes and sins in HA : who cares?
People use Hexes and sins in GvG : aarrgggl nerf nerf wtf!!

So seriously , i am just gonna make a bbway guild just to see some nerf to be honest

Elnino · Nov 09, 2010, 08:41 AM // 08:41

After looking at that screenshot (and not knowing what the builds are) I assume that vR would of had a chance if they had split effectively and had better monks.

On another note, I'm expecting to see some sort of change to assault enchantments. Being able to spam it on someone is just way too powerful.

tealspikes · Nov 09, 2010, 09:05 AM // 09:05

GvG = barbed signet vs heal party

with some gimmick sins and OP hexes thrown in

Sytherek · Nov 09, 2010, 12:59 PM // 12:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Just Sai

How did you get that display? I can't find a single slash commend that shows damage data.

Thanks.

Arduin · Nov 09, 2010, 01:41 PM // 13:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sytherek

How did you get that display? I can't find a single slash commend that shows damage data.

Thanks.

It isn't a command, talk to the Master of Damage.

hitsuji182 · Nov 09, 2010, 01:44 PM // 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Missing HB

Rofl , so yes as i said all updates are centered around GvG.
People use hexes and sins in HA : who cares?
People use Hexes and sins in GvG : aarrgggl nerf nerf wtf!!

So seriously , i am just gonna make a bbway guild just to see some nerf to be honest

Yeah, HA seems to be totally abandoned... If BBway won't get nerfed in next update... Argh, I don't even want to think like that! TK, I'm sure you read this - just make falling-skills from BBway build required 5 Critical Strikes to work and that's all...

Xenomortis · Nov 09, 2010, 02:18 PM // 14:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by reaper with no name

Give me any dervish build in PvE that isn't absolutely worthless, and I will give you a build for another profession that does it better.

I don't care about that though. The power level of the profession is fine, it's just that the Scythe is broken and Mysticism sucks.
You certainly don't buff something just because broken shit beats it.

Killed u man · Nov 09, 2010, 02:20 PM // 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by bursta91

yes, hexes should stay untouched...
as lemming linked, almost every single elims was hexes vs something hexy.

Well, hexes are definatly overpowered, but posting a picture of one gimmick beating another gimmick doesn't really hold any value, aside from the fact that this one gimmick counters the other one.

A good hexway is about the best build one could run in GvG, and even with counters (which can be countered by the hexway's mesmer rupts) it still poses a good thread (as shown in the mAT). However, triple melee comes in a closes second when on the overpowered scale. Trip melee requires ALOT more skill to be run sucessfully because you can't have retarded warriors (bad warriors make for an OK trip melee, terrible warriors for a shit one) and you need to have a Ranger capable of doing only a bit less than a ranger would have to do in balanced. (Since the Necro carries more responsibility regarding movement control)

If nerfing hexway is the start of a big campaign (Humme makes it sound like this), I don't see why Hammer warriors, MoI, Bsurge, Barbed Sig, Aura of Stability, Healer's Boon, Storm Djinns/Armor of Mist, ... all shouldn't get touched aswell. I mean, I would love for nothing more than all these power creeped skills to get nerfed, so that every other skill becomes viable. (Nerfing one skill means every other skill in the game becomes more viable)

I mean, with hexway AND heal party gone, what's going to stop people from running nothing but trip melee (similar to now, except there won't be a counter whatsoever, aside from wards which can be rupted)?

As for PvE:

Are there still people arguing all of the current meta builds aren't shit easy? I vanquished about 3 years ago when I still had my old acount, and I remembered it being RED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GORED ENGINE GOing hard. Not insanely hard because sabway and discord was, in fact, around, but atleast harder than it is now.

You can't argue the fact that HM is redicilously easy for being called that way, and that speedclears show the fact that it can still get abused really easy. Tough, Shadow Form, and every form of invinci-tanking, are still the root of the problem here (Ball foes up who are too busy trying to attack a target they can't kill), they should've done something a long time ago about this.

Why skeletons of dhuum didn't get enchant strips was beyond me, as their intire purpose was to counter speedclears (of which every form relies on enchantments), whereas balanced teams, or atleast less gimmicky teams have other resources. (Spirits, blocking, a WARRIOR absorbing damage which his natural armor, etc)

I'm just extremely dissapointed a to how easy PvE has become. Normal Mode is litterely having one of those red birds that go up and down play for you. Hard Mode is the same thing, you just got to make sure you have a decent hero setup.

Nyta · Nov 09, 2010, 02:20 PM // 14:20

This might be a really stupid question, but where did the rumor that there's an update coming this Thursday come from? Does the rumor have a basis?

aspi · Nov 09, 2010, 02:23 PM // 14:23

Delete shadow form from the game.
Sure there are lots of other OP skills but I have never been a fan of this stupid skill.

FengShuiDove · Nov 09, 2010, 02:36 PM // 14:36

Even if you kill SF entirely, there will be a replacement. While I was toying around the other day, it turns out you can negate pretty much all damage with a dedicated bonder using 3 skills. In HM DoA. Yes, I had 10 damage reduction from SF and Shroud but that was pre-bonds, so it doesn't make a lot of difference. Heck, even a Vow of Silence Derv with proper bonds could replace an SF sin for many purposes.

Speed clears are part of the game now. Unless there is a change to the objectives of areas, not the skills used in them or the foes' skills or AI, speed clears will just evolve around updates. There's no point hurting any more skills unless you're just out to get them.

I still don't really understand why AP is on the chopping block though

. Discord is easy, but it's not broken and it's not the most efficient way of playing. At this point I run Discord still as a base for team setups (MM bomber and N/Rt Resto are very sound), if Discord itself were nerfed I'd just throw AotL or Jagged on the MM and Xinrae's/WoR/Icy Veins on the Resto. Given the kinds of hell the rest of my team can unleash, it hardly makes a difference. And I never role AP anymore, it's way more fun (and usually more effective) to run a physical bar, for damage, control, and party support.

I'd rather see a nerf to the incredible PvE only skills from GW:EN than an AP nerf. I've said it before: in what context is a 10e, 10s, instant cast KD, cripple, and armor ignoring damage not broken?

Axel Zinfandel · Nov 09, 2010, 02:59 PM // 14:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Karate Jesus

The rumors I've heard most often include:

VoR Mes nerf
Stand Necro nerf
Heal Party nerf
General sin buff/nerf including an AP nerf and Temple Strike buff (I won't post specifics)
No Dervish Changes (given up on them)

I can't comment on PvP changes other than what might fall over into PvE with Anet not deeming worthy enough for skill split you better believe if it's heal party or something, they won't bother.

Why ER eles Havnt been touched is beyond me. Maybe because the only other thing Elsa have to run is Bsurge or something (if that's still viable?). ER itself is detrimental to how viable monks are, and how teams are ran in PvE.

AP needs the nerf IMO. I wouldn't be surprised if Anet wants to nerf discord builds before the release of 7 hero parties.. It's way outdated anyway.
Other sin nerf/buffs make me nervous. I don't want then touching jagged/fox/DB combo, and if they do, certainly not in a way that kills it. A buff to dagger elites would be interesting, most def.

But what really would bother me is if after all these months they can back and shrugged with nothing for dervs. They should by all means have SOMETHING by now, and if they don't give us that, at least bring in something from the other classes mentioned (smite/para)

Minimal skill balancing would aggravate me. They did a good enough job buffing Rits and Mesmers, save The few OP skills that seem to overshadow in peoples' minds. If they aren't going to deliver, they should stop making promises.

Killed u man · Nov 09, 2010, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiDove

Even if you kill SF entirely, there will be a replacement. While I was toying around the other day, it turns out you can negate pretty much all damage with a dedicated bonder using 3 skills. In HM DoA. Yes, I had 10 damage reduction from SF and Shroud but that was pre-bonds, so it doesn't make a lot of difference. Heck, even a Vow of Silence Derv with proper bonds could replace an SF sin for many purposes.

Speed clears are part of the game now. Unless there is a change to the objectives of areas, not the skills used in them or the foes' skills or AI, speed clears will just evolve around updates. There's no point hurting any more skills unless you're just out to get them.

I still don't really understand why AP is on the chopping block though

. Discord is easy, but it's not broken and it's not the most efficient way of playing. At this point I run Discord still as a base for team setups (MM bomber and N/Rt Resto are very sound), if Discord itself were nerfed I'd just throw AotL or Jagged on the MM and Xinrae's/WoR/Icy Veins on the Resto. Given the kinds of hell the rest of my team can unleash, it hardly makes a difference. And I never role AP anymore, it's way more fun (and usually more effective) to run a physical bar, for damage, control, and party support.

I'd rather see a nerf to the incredible PvE only skills from GW:EN than an AP nerf. I've said it before: in what context is a 10e, 10s, instant cast KD, cripple, and armor ignoring damage not broken?

Every build you can think off relies on enchantments. Usually, all the tanks have to do is make sure they can't be the target of spells, and bam invinci tank 99 of GW's areas.

It would be too hard/much work to add non-spell enchant removal to all areas, but for grenth's sake give the skeletons of dhuum a monster SKILL enchant strip of maximum 3/4s cast so that atleast UW doesn't become easy mode.

Scary · Nov 09, 2010, 03:01 PM // 15:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by FengShuiDove

Even if you kill SF entirely, there will be a replacement. While I was toying around the other day, it turns out you can negate pretty much all damage with a dedicated bonder using 3 skills. In HM DoA. Yes, I had 10 damage reduction from SF and Shroud but that was pre-bonds, so it doesn't make a lot of difference. Heck, even a Vow of Silence Derv with proper bonds could replace an SF sin for many purposes.

Speed clears are part of the game now. Unless there is a change to the objectives of areas, not the skills used in them or the foes' skills or AI, speed clears will just evolve around updates. There's no point hurting any more skills unless you're just out to get them.

I still don't really understand why AP is on the chopping block though

. Discord is easy, but it's not broken and it's not the most efficient way of playing. At this point I run Discord still as a base for team setups (MM bomber and N/Rt Resto are very sound), if Discord itself were nerfed I'd just throw AotL or Jagged on the MM and Xinrae's/WoR/Icy Veins on the Resto. Given the kinds of hell the rest of my team can unleash, it hardly makes a difference. And I never role AP anymore, it's way more fun (and usually more effective) to run a physical bar, for damage, control, and party support.

I'd rather see a nerf to the incredible PvE only skills from GW:EN than an AP nerf. I've said it before: in what context is a 10e, 10s, instant cast KD, cripple, and armor ignoring damage not broken?

It is....but who cares... no one obligates U to use it. Some of us do like it
so where noob dumb and lazy, but enjoy it... Dont nerf PvE skills, they are a
choosable not required. So leave them alone

I think considering the PvE part that some classes could use a buf or change
as the Derv and beastmaster/spirits of a ranger.
And yes some others are strong. But than again it's PvE... so thats to
everybody's choise how to use it.

PvP is a total differnt story. And I'm no PvP player so would not know
what skills would need a nerf or others a buf. But PvP really needs ballance.
So that is where the main job shoud be about by changing skills.

PvE is all about fun, so pls don't nerf any skills any more. Just buf or change some functionalities

Artisan Archer · Nov 09, 2010, 03:06 PM // 15:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Killed u man

I mean, with hexway AND heal party gone, what's going to stop people from running nothing but trip melee (similar to now, except there won't be a counter whatsoever, aside from wards which can be rupted)?

With the stand necro nerf, I don't know how good trip front will still be. I do agree though that some (passive) midline defense needs to be made a tiny bit stronger (the paragon chants, wards) without falling back in the rawr defense ball meta.

Killed u man · Nov 09, 2010, 03:21 PM // 15:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scary

It is....but who cares... no one obligates U to use it. Some of us do like it
so where noob dumb and lazy, but enjoy it... Dont nerf PvE skills, they are a
choosable not required. So leave them alone

Everything in PvE is tied together because the market value of drops relies on the input of the intire community.

If you have 5 people who farm ectos at a rate of 10/hour because they use broken builds (pve skills or not) and 50 people who farm at 1 ecto/hour because they use balanced builds, the 5 people are going to have the same marketweight as the 50 people and eventually push prices down if they need to get rid of their ectos fast.

This is a gross overexaggeration, but this is essentially how it works. For you, Shadowform or all these imbalanced builds might seem like a fun way to play, but for alot of other people these builds serve the means to farm 6 hours a day, and massively sell their loot at an everlasting declining price because of the massive input people like these create.

This (and to a far less extend people needing less ectos) is the cause why ectos have gone down from 10+K to 3.5K, and now recently back up to 7K as the result of the nerfs to the solo farm builds.

DRGN · Nov 09, 2010, 03:29 PM // 15:29

It's about damn time hexway got some sort of nerf. Hexes have been incredibly stupid for way too long now.